Comments (47)

Arkansan wrote on April 18, 2007 12:04 PM:

Obscene. A political party privilege! Is that the cousin of the priest/penitent privilege?

Is there any choice but impeachment? This will drag on until this administration is over and the next neocons gang of thugs has taken its place.

Anonymous wrote on April 18, 2007 12:05 PM:

I believe that the DNC handed over e-mails and documents directly to Dan Burton's Congressional committee back in the 90's when he was engaged in his various Clinton investigations.

They did not pass through the Clinton White House for review.

How is this any different?

grandpa john wrote on April 18, 2007 12:13 PM:

how is this different, the integrity and honesty of the people involved. This is one time where the republican criminals can't say the Clinton did it too.

kady wrote on April 18, 2007 12:13 PM:

The police investigate a mob syndicate--they want all the e-mails that the mob sent/received. So now the police have to let the mob "filter" what e-mails they get? This sucks--suspects should not be allowed to do this. Where's the justice? Oh, yeah, all used up in the Clinton impeachment.

I love security codes: face--you no good, two-faced, lying, son of . . .

grandpa john wrote on April 18, 2007 12:14 PM:

how is this different, the integrity and honesty of the people involved. This is one time where the republican criminals can't say the Clinton did it too.

bobh wrote on April 18, 2007 12:23 PM:

grow some balls DEMS....for christs sake grow some balls and call them on it - now.

ohthehugemanatee wrote on April 18, 2007 12:26 PM:

Speaking of Rove e-mails, and correct me if I'm wrong, but I have a question regarding the Jan 6. "Question from Karl Rove" e-mail and Gonzales' prepared statement.

If I've been following things correctly, this e-mail corrected the WH claim that Miers first brought up firing all of the USA's in Feb 05 (after-all, how could Rove ask about it beforehand in Jan 05). The WH then had to push the timeline back, inferring that Miers brought it up earlier.

Further, in gonzales' prepared statement for this week, he says,

“Shortly after the 2004 election and soon after I became Attorney General, my then-deputy-chief-of-staff Kyle Sampson told me that then-Counsel to the President Harriet Miers had inquired about replacing all 93 U.S. Attorneys. Mr. Sampson and I both agreed that replacing all 93 U.S. Attorneys would be disruptive and unwise.”

In a Nov. 17, 2004 press release Bush says Miers will assume her position as Counsel following the confirmation of Gonzales as AG (which occured on Feb 3).

So, if Mier's wasn't Counsel until Feb. 3, either Gonzales is mixing up in calling her 'Counsel' (she was still Dep. Chief of Staff for Policy) or his story isn't lining up with the WH claim that Miers first brought up the purge.

Garth wrote on April 18, 2007 12:31 PM:

security code: still

as in "still waiting for impeachment"

Garth wrote on April 18, 2007 12:31 PM:

security code: still

as in "still" waiting for impeachment

EdNSted wrote on April 18, 2007 12:33 PM:

As an outside observer, it is currently impossible for me to determine to any degree of certainty whether Conyers is executing a carefully considerd plan here or whether the Democrats on the House Judiciary Committee are simply being led around by their nose rings.

I know time will tell but time is not an infinite resource.

MediaFreeze wrote on April 18, 2007 12:35 PM:

"So Dems, whaddya gonna do about it?”

mbbsdphil wrote on April 18, 2007 12:40 PM:

Anyone giving up data tries to keep the original. If they can't, they keep copies; if for no other reason, to prove what they delivered up and when. The Senate should subpoena the RNC-held data.

If the RNC didn't lie, and they treated WH e-mails as ordinary traffic, the e-mails have lost any privilege that might have applied to them. The RNC would have no legal basis to refuse to deliver them up to a valid demand from Congress.

But let's get the facts. Call the RNC IT administrators, get a copy of any contract for IT services, get testimony and supporting docs about routine administration and compare it with administration of the WH stuff.

Odds are, the RNC has pretty high security and tight protocols; they wouldn't their machinations coming out. But that's not likely to shield WH stuff, some of which is likely to have intentionally been dealt with differently than other e-mail.

Follow the evidence of intentional conduct, as well as the money. All good to know when the e-mails, or versions of them, do show up.

sy wrote on April 18, 2007 12:41 PM:

John,

Issue a subpoena and let the RNC and WH contest it in court with an absurd privilege argument. Don't forget to throw around "spoliation" issues while in front of the judge.

DF wrote on April 18, 2007 12:47 PM:

A "reasonable request" just like the take it or leave it offer for an off the record chat with Rove was "reasonable and extraordinary". Time to find another adjective GOP.

John in Erie wrote on April 18, 2007 12:50 PM:

Isn't it also amazing that all Blackberry service was suspended last night?? Must be the new servers that are being put in to replace the ones that had Karl's messages on.

I'm not normally a tin hat, but....?

Code word push: push back now!!!

otob wrote on April 18, 2007 12:53 PM:

since they haven't issued the subpoena yet, I guess they have no legal basis to challenge this. once the subpoena is issued, it should bypass the WH.

the reason they are able to do this is the congress' unwillingness to fight.

FeralL wrote on April 18, 2007 12:58 PM:

Any chance this could turn around and bite them? If the White House then turns over redacted emails to Conyers with the excuse that they contain sensitive information, isn't that admission that they were illegally using non-White House systems for sending them?

jeri frederick wrote on April 18, 2007 1:02 PM:

I'm wondering about the lost service to Blackberries, too. What do you think? They destroyed something that caused an outage? IANA techie so I'm not sure of the significance. But, I think it raises questions.

Kathy wrote on April 18, 2007 1:06 PM:

I wish they (Conyers, etc) would send the FBI to confiscate all the RNC drives. Please don't wait around while the Repugs wipe them, loose them, crush them with steam rollers.

Long Memory wrote on April 18, 2007 1:12 PM:

Isn't it time for somebody, preferably a Special Prosecutor, to begin an investigation to see if the Hatch Act has been violated? Perhaps it would be more correct to say "investigation of how many times the Hatch Act has been violated?"

magster wrote on April 18, 2007 1:12 PM:

Congress should do more than subpoena. They should subpoena the servers and send out the Congress marshalls to seize the servers.

The benefit is that it forces Bush to go to Court to quash the subpoena rather than force Congress to go to Court to enforce the subpoena.

The burden shifting is an advantage heading into court.

Crust wrote on April 18, 2007 1:26 PM:

Long Memory, if I understand correctly the issue with using the RNC emails for White House business is violations of the Presidential Records Act and the White House email policy. Excessive caution in complying with the Hatch Act is their excuse for violating the Records Act (and their stated policies).

Also, if they used the RNC account to comply with the Hatch Act that would seem to rule out executive privilege arguments (which are already strained for communications between aides -- as opposed to directly with the President -- even on White Houe email).

mbbsdphil wrote on April 18, 2007 1:30 PM:

I was also wondering who besides the NSA or Pentagon has the resources to disrupt Blackberry service across all of North America? I imagine RIM has a good idea by now.

Only John le Carre would wonder if that was a shot across the bow, a polite suggestion about what could happen if they have copies of any data sent by persons of interest. What a world Mr. Bush has created in order to set us free.

crick02478 wrote on April 18, 2007 1:35 PM:

On a related note, the linked WaPo article cites a "leading House Democrat" as being "told that as many as four years' worth of Rove's RNC e-mails may be missing. The e-mails are also sought in a congressional investigation of the alleged politicization of the General Services Administration."

This ridiculousness just has to stop. Would everyone out there who work at occupations where you have a legal responsibility for document preservation please raise your hand if wishy-washy excuses for your failure to do so would e accepted by your superiors and the legal entities charged with oversight of your particular area? Wait a minute....I don't see any hands.....

Let me also be the first to say that I believe the fix was in with old Patrick Fitzgerald. If the average prosecutor could indict a ham sandwich, I can't see how Mr. Fitzgerald could not indict and convict Mr. Rove of obstruction of justice based on the disappearance of four years worth of e-mails.

Its time to stop patting Mr. Fitzgerald on the back and start asking some questions about just how Rove got off the hook given soemthing as egregious the e-mail mishandling, not too mention all the other evidence.

John in Erie wrote on April 18, 2007 1:41 PM:

The WH must be in full panic mode:

April 17, 2007 — Our sources inform us that a possible fire today has knocked out classified communications services at the US State Department’s Communications Annex facility (State Communications Annex - SA26 - in Beltsville, Maryland), just outside of Washington, DC. Also affected by the outage is the joint National Security Agency-Central Intelligence Agency Special Collection Service (SCS) (F6) (”CSSG”) located in a building off Springfield Road and located adjacent to SA-26, which is located at 8101 Odell Road. The SCS relies on the State Department backbone secure satellite communications for its links to covert listening posts and devices around the world. Agencies affected by the communications outage are the State Department, NSA, CIA, and Department of Defense. The State Department has been forced to use its backup facility. a CIA facility located at Brandy Station in northern Virginia.

My tin hat is starting to melt!!!!

Glom wrote on April 18, 2007 1:44 PM:

Good thing they were able to get Blackberry to shut down for the day so they could delete While House emails.

TR wrote on April 18, 2007 1:44 PM:

I agree with Crust. It seems patently absurd that the WH could claim executive privilege over messages sent outside the WH system. The entire reason the WH has their own internal email system is to communicate official business with other WH staff. Once the president and staff left that system and used another, that would seem to be prima facie evidence that WH business was not involved.

Anonymous wrote on April 18, 2007 1:46 PM:

White House + RNC = Co-conspiracy of historic proportions!

Also, this just in...

Va. Gunman Had 2 Past Stalking Cases

By ADAM GELLER
The Associated Press
Wednesday, April 18, 2007; 1:27 PM

BLACKSBURG, Va. -- The gunman blamed for the deadliest shooting in modern U.S. history had previously been accused of stalking two female students at Virginia Tech and had been taken to a mental health facility in 2005 after an acquaintance worried he might be suicidal, police said Wednesday. Cho Seung-Hui had concerned one woman enough with his calls and e-mail in 2005 that police were called in, said Police Chief Wendell Flinchum.

So how did this proven stalker manage to buy a gun? "Cho Seung-Hui had concerned one woman enough with his calls and e-mail in 2005 that police were called in,"

if criticizing Bush for lying in his SOTU propaganda event, can get you put on a no-fly list, shouldn't something like this put up some red flags for someone trying to buy a weapon???

HYPOCRITES...

JEP wrote on April 18, 2007 1:46 PM:

to sign that last post...

John in Erie wrote on April 18, 2007 2:00 PM:

I sure hope the NSC-CIA SCS group has back-ups. John LeCarre didn't believe in "coincidences" either.
The committees better get those subpoenas out now and have the servers confiscated NOW. Something is amiss in Hooterville. As a certain well-known sleuth said: "The game is afoot!"

Code word: color, as in a "shady" color

Anonymous wrote on April 18, 2007 2:17 PM:

If the purpose of executive privilege is to permit the President to receive truthful and direct counsel from his advisors, then how does protection of emails sent by an advisor to a private citizen by using a private (or at least, unofficial) email account even begin to justify the application of the privilege? I thought Republicans didn't like to make up new legal rights that aren't expressed in the text of the constitution...

JEP wrote on April 18, 2007 2:20 PM:

'As a certain well-known sleuth said: "The game is afoot!"'

It doesn't take a Sherlock Holmes to smell a rat in this situation.

The James Bond writers would be hard-pressed to come up with a fiction scenario with as much intrigue and twisted plot developments as we have seen simnce the Dems whooped up on the R's in November. Since then, it's been a constant state of denial, deletion, shredding and cover-up that probably has few precedents in all of history.

To call this administration "historic" barely scratches the surface. Historically tragic might be the better term.

JEP wrote on April 18, 2007 2:38 PM:

One thing this proves beyon a shadow of a doubt..

Thar's gold in them thar emails!

If not, the WH wouldn't be claiming them.

Now if the Congressional Prospectors can just get up into the hills, no doubt they will find the Mother Lode, wearing a see-through "dress"...

("dress" was my codeword, just for kicks, I've begun to add the codeword in as part of the body of my posts, in quotes so as to show where it was applied...)

otob wrote on April 18, 2007 3:10 PM:

i love it. there is no one left to investigate. they're burning the records. go great justice.

Anna S. wrote on April 18, 2007 3:19 PM:

I'm still curious as to what "unique and significant" privilege they are asserting. We all know the Executive Interest privilege shouldn't apply, and they seem to have invented an "Executive Branch Interest" in that letter to the RNC that they presumably are responding to here. Well, seems to me that branch interest is certainly unique, in the sense that no one's heard of it before, and significant in the sense that if it applies it's the end of branch equality for our government.

The question now is about what's to be done. I really do think that a subpoena is in order, even if the RNC refuses to act on it. If nothing else, a subpoena gives the Dems leverage in the Court of Public Opinion, because I can't help but think that the MSM will get interested if Congressional subpoenas are being ignored.

Kate Henry wrote on April 18, 2007 3:54 PM:

It's time to charge Karl Rove and others for violations of the Hatch Act. By the Bush Admin and the RNC saying that these e-mails are covered by executive privilege, that means that they are e-mails regarding government business. Ok Conyers, what are you waiting for?

Poggy wrote on April 18, 2007 4:44 PM:

Is it just me, or do the Dems seem to be caving in?
What's with all this politeness? The republicans are covering up massing crimes while the dems are just playing nice. ARggggg!

Steven S. wrote on April 18, 2007 7:20 PM:

I think "all this politeness" is feeding them rope.
Giving them more chances to lie. Making the story more and more and more complicated until they're going to trip themselves up; they'll have no choice.
It's the same "negligent or corrupt" double-pronged fork the whole Administration will soon be roasting on.

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